powder puff football game gets violent

[Orestes]

girls really are nuts!
__________________________________________________ __

Principal says school officials tried to thwart high school hazing
Girls describe choking, kicking at football game ritual
Friday, May 9, 2003 Posted: 10:23 AM EDT (1423 GMT)


NORTHBROOK, Illinois (CNN) -- School administrators at a suburban Chicago school where an off-campus touch football hazing ritual turned violent made efforts to get the unsanctioned event canceled, the principal said Thursday.

Michael Riggle said administrators at Glenbrook North High School tried to find out where and when the game, which serves as an initiation into the senior class for the juniors, was going to be played.

Witnesses at Sunday's game said it never got under way and what began as some light hazing quickly escalated to violence, sending five junior girls to the hospital for treatment before their release.

Riggle said that the previous Friday, students "were not forthcoming" about what had become "a covert activity." In fact, details were kept so secret that many of the participants did not know until an hour before the game took place what the time and location would be.

The time and location of the game changes from year to year, though this was the first time that it had such a violent outcome, Riggle said.

Two of the junior girls who had to be treated at the hospital said they had no idea they would be subject to a violent attack.

"I was strangled and choked, and I was kicked in the head repeatedly," Lauren said.

Another, junior class member, Marina, said she was "repeatedly kicked and punched," adding "they kicked my tailbone to the point that it fractured."

The girls, identified only by first names, spoke to CNN about Sunday's incident.

"This has been a tradition in our school, to play football, not [to] be beaten up and put into the hospital," Marina said.

The girls said they had been told they would not be physically harmed but might have to endure light hazing such as ketchup, mustard and whipped cream being smeared in their hair.

Three other girls were treated and released from Glenbrook Hospital, spokeswoman Karen Ganz told CNN Wednesday. Ganz declined to describe their injuries because the patients are minors.

Attorney compares attack to lynching
Police said criminal charges against the perpetrators could be filed Thursday or Friday. Authorities said an amateur videotape shot at the scene indicates premeditation because some of the attackers had baseball bats.

"We believe there was some premeditation on the part of some of the attackers to go after some specific victims," Rollin Soskin, an attorney representing Lauren and Marina, said appearing with them on CNN's "American Morning."


Students huddled together on the ground during the attack.
"Nobody brings a baseball bat or a paint pellet gun to a powder puff football game."

"This was a vicious attack," Soskin said. "This was a lynching."

The tape shows several students huddled together on the ground while others threw objects at them, including large plastic buckets.

One girl walks behind the seated girls and slaps them on the back of the head. Another girl holds up what appears to be an intestine. At least one girl reported having a pig's intestine wrapped around her neck.

Witnesses also reported that urine, feces and fish guts were thrown and others said they had been forced to eat mud.

"Basically it started out as a fun hazing like our initiation into our senior year," said a junior girl who had been injured. "About 10 minutes into it everything changed -- buckets were flying ... people were bleeding. Girls were unconscious."

Dozens of students had come to watch the event and some of them, including male bystanders, joined in.

Principal supports prosecution
Riggle said Wednesday the school supports criminal prosecution of the perpetrators.

"I feel that the behavior that went on was certainly extreme and I think that it does get into the point of criminal actions," Riggle told CNN. "The school is fully supportive of prosecution at this point."

In 1979, there were problems with powder puff or touch football games and the school discontinued the games, which had been used as fund-raisers, Riggle said. Since then, the matches have been organized by the students.

I think that it does get into the point of criminal actions.
-- Michael Riggle, Glenbrook North principal

But Soskin did not absolve the school of responsibility, saying that although it was not a school-sanctioned event or on school property, school administrators certainly knew the game was going to take place.

The Cook County sheriff's department and the county's Forest Preserve District police are investigating the incident, which happened on Forest Preserve property near Northbrook.

Glenbrook North High School is in Northbrook, a suburb north of Chicago. Riggle agreed with a reporter's depiction of the school's students as being mainly "upper middle class," adding that some 85 percent go on to four-year colleges.

[DogStarMan]

That brings back such pleasant High School memories.

[RichmondVA]

Anytime I read a story like this, I'm bothered by the same questions:

1) What kind of feces and where did they get it?
2) Were any of them hot?

[cuddlyevil]

This scares me, at my high school we had was known as "freshman friday" it usually happened the first full week of school and if you were a freshman, you were a target--at worst, you'd be sprayed with really nasty cologne or whipped cream; but some folks got nair in their hair and others were egged (one kid was egged, went home and changed came back and got egged again 3 times before the school just told him to stay home). But it never got anything like this, hell half the fraternities where I went to college weren't this violent...

[monkey neck]

They used pig intestines. Pig Intestines. Who thought of that? And furthermore, where do you even get pig intestines???
Holy crap.

[classicgrrl]

Originally posted by monkey neck
They used pig intestines. Pig Intestines. Who thought of that? And furthermore, where do you even get pig intestines???
Holy crap.

out of pig. seriously, you can purchase them. pickedled even.

this is just sickly disturbing. and the fact that it took place in the suburbs does not surprise me.

i grew up in a 'burb' and frankly I think they all should be bombed into oblivion...

[monkey neck]

Originally posted by classicgrrl


out of pig.

Like I'm supposed to believe that! :D

[SteelTown Boy]

brutal....

[GWB]

Originally posted by monkey neck
And furthermore, where do you even get pig intestines???
Holy crap.

http://www.angelfire.com/mb/carrie/images/ssblack1.jpg

Why don't you ask her?:D

[tobedawg]

They used pig intestines. Pig Intestines. Who thought of that? And furthermore, where do you even get pig intestines???

Did the marching band get replaced with GWAR or something?

[Kittymld]

I saw the video for this finally and they better fuckin' sue for everything they can.

[classicgrrl]

Originally posted by tobedawg


Did the marching band get replaced with GWAR or something?

Dewd dont even go there. When I was in marching I got hit in the head and shoulder by a metal folding chair swung by the opposing football team...

in the burbs.

bomb into oblivion I tell you.

[classicgrrl]

Originally posted by classicgrrl


Dewd dont even go there. When I was in marching band I got hit in the head and shoulder by a metal folding chair swung by the opposing football team...

in the burbs.

bomb into oblivion I tell you.

this is why you dont post at 2:00 AM in the morning...sorry guys.

[into the void]

i have been following this brutal lynching since last week, catching many 24/7 news clips/interviews and reading numerous online news articles/opinions.
as the father of a 3 yr old girl whose consciousness and sense of conscience will be shaped by her environment, i shudder to think that this kind of soulless inhumanity(perpetrated by these girls in the name of 'FUN'!) can be commonplace..and in many unrecognized ways(which produces the monsters you see in these video's) is condoned through the familiarity and mindless acceptance of "all american values" which are rooted in our culture's collective competitive pride, superficiality and unbridled 'me first!' greed.

i have simply not been able to wrap my head around this hazing, so to speak.
there are undeniable variables that brought this hazing about, but all of the pop-psychology in the world will never completely explain the sickening ferocity of how this 'lynching' was strategically premeditated and viciously carried out.

I AM APPALLED. period. what happened is as bad as it seems, and worse.

the presence of alcohol and pre-existing 'boyfriend fueds' among some of these girls can in no way justify what occurred. that so many 'so-called' top students, popular students, who excell in their academics and athletics, perpetrated this, actually does not surprise me. no, what DOES surprise me, truly frightens me, is that so many people could be this unconsciounable and devoid of the most fundamental sense of human civility and compassion...the monsters doing the actual hazing, and the apathetic mob who let this take place in front of their eyes, many cheering the debauchery on, some joining in, and sadly(yet fortunately, in this instance)capturing the horror on film for the world to see.

i suspect that many 'passive observers' showed up that day because it WAS known and rumored among the senior girls that they had something this awful in mind.
remember, these girls went to great lengths to prepare for this, and used cell phones/email to keep changing the location and time in order to ensure no parent, school official, police, or apparently, anyone with any sense of conscience, could interfere and prevent them from carrying this out. some claim that they didn't know the actual location/time until an hour before.

WHY HAVE NO CRIMINAL CHARGES BEEN FILED?!

these girls gathered an enormous stockpile of spoiled food, paint, animal guts, and numerous buckets/coolers/bags of a filth that consisted of human waste, blood, fish guts, urine, paint thinner, etc...will it ultimately be discovered that perhaps some of the parents(which has been reported)played a part in helping to gather the feces? do they no someone who works at the city sanitation dept(?)..or are we to accept the cold blooded notion that these girls and maybe(?)some parents spent who-knows how many days prior to this collecting their own bowel movements, knowing all the while what the intended purpose was? either way, it is simply unfathomable. the mind recoils in horror..yet, if you spent any time at all watching this unfold on cable news, you've seen more than enough video footage(of which some of the most vile and violent parts are not being shown to the public)to know that they had this gore in mass supply.
this, along with the fact that a baseball bat and paint-pellet gun were brought and used, shows that the 'event' was most definately premeditated.

one girl had coffe grounds jammed into her ears, a bucket placed over her head and was then beaten about the head with a baseball bat until she was unconscious. she suffered a sever concussion(click link below)
another girl can be seen repeatedly firing the pellet gun, point blank range, at one of the junior girls, who wails in agony.

aside from the outstanding physical beatings that can be seen(groups of seniors ganging up and kicking, punching 16 yr old girls)the 'real' horror of what you see is how 30/40 seemingly normal girls are taking such delight in walking around groups of dazed junior girls, huddled together on the ground, smearing filth in their faces and hair.
the facial expressions of the senior girls range from 'hey, i'm having a good time', to outright sadistic glee, to absolute rage and hatred as they scream, spit on, slap/punch and violently hurl empty bottles, bins and five-gallon buckets at the younger girls, often times, quite intentionally, striking them in the head.
some girls were held down and forced to ingest human feces..it was shoved into their mouths and then they would be punched in the throat until they swallowed.

it is absolutely HORRIFYING, as many terrible images as i have seen throughout the history of mankind, up to the present, the images of these kids(18 yr old adults), a large group of people, actually having fun as they brutalize other people with this degree of violent sadism, is one of the most disturbing things i have ever seen.

and in my own community here, i am left scratching my head as to why more people aren't equally as outraged.
i was born in woodstock, ill., and lived in rockford, ill until moving years ago. the small town i live in now is not very different from northbrook, i'm sure, yet the local news here has not even mentioned this story. and people who only catch a brief snipet on cable news, are not given a well-rounded picture of this atrocity.
i cannot help but think that northbrook would've swept this under the rug had it not gained world wide attention.

one is forced to not only question the values and inhumanity of the senior girls & the onlookers, but the complicated futility of ignorance involved. they took measures to ensure that what they had planned would not be prevented from happening, yet they carried out this brutality in front of(reportedly)20 to 30 video camera's, while wearing numbered jersey's.
wha?!
what does this say about the substance and ultimate worth of what is being taught to kids in our schools, since many of the senior girls who participated, and in fact, some of the worst perpetrators, were 'top' students at a well-respected school?

considering how superficiality is promoted as the highest ideal in this culture(while paying lip service denail to the contrary)is it any wonder that these girls are capable of what they did?

you're never going to hear this kind of talk in the 'news'.
this culture, this 'system of values', is very effective in that it makes opposing greed seem futile, if not absurd. dissenters and counterviews are quickly dismissed and discredited.

communities should be examining what happened and taking a long, hard look in the mirror..but of course, this incident, as horrific as it is, as, dare i say, 'evil' as it is, will be forgotten and clumped in with the rest of the nightmares that scar their way into our consciousness, and no one will be as concerned as they should be until it happens in their own backyard.
and then what? try to defend such savage inhumanity, as some of the senior girls' parents are?
can you imagine this insult to injury..suing the school for the only punishment it can serve? yet i'd be willing to bet that if you asked any one of those girls what they think about a rapist suing, and thereby blaming, the victim, they'd be up-in-arms.
18 yr old marnie holz, the first girl to bring such a suit, is using "assumption of risk".
she is saying that since the junior girls knew what they were getting into, that her, and ostensibly, her counterparts, are innocent.

the senior girls, according to many interviews, are completely unremorseful, and shrug what they did off as 'no big deal'.
i find it terrifying to know that many of these girls will someday have children of their own.

another thing i find interesting, if not offensive, is how this hazing has been compared to other teen violence, such as what happened at columbine.
in no way am i trying to justify what happened there, but the sad truth is, many times the reason that there are kids who flip out and kill other's and/or themselves, is BECAUSE of girls like the ones who carried out this hazing.
it's often the most presentable, popular kids, usually involved in athletics(extracirricular activity that is in keeping with the most exhaulted characteristics & mindset of the culture)that are the ones who have learned the 'values' very well. they are often the ones who have an unbridled lust for social tyranny, and it's the kids who are singled out for ridicule and abuse, by them, who find their back against the wall with no one to turn to..no one who will 'believe' that there actually are human monsters in the guise of 'good students' , popular kids, whose actions, as apparent by looking at the junior('hazed')girls in these videos, are often scarred for life.

i know of what i speak. i am 33 yrs old, and it's been many years ago now that i dropped out of high school w/my GED, for these kinds of reasons.
seeing this kind of social tyranny/brutality really strikes a nerve in me.

as i've been writing, i periodically look over at my daughter, playing and coloring, and i cannot imagine empathizing with the girls's parents. how would i react and live with the fact that i had raised a child who was capable of committing something so terrible? was it murder? no.
although it easily could've been. what did take place, however, in how basic, fundamental humanity was completely discarded, is no less appalling.

funny, i've been listening to "the doors" while writing this.."this is the end, beautiful friend"
unless more people wake up, i think it will be the end.

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/GMA/US/GMA030507powder_puff_melee.html
http://www.msnbc.com/news/912067.asp?cp1=1
http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/chi-0305130285may13,0,7402154.story?coll=ny-nationalnews-headlines

[DogStarMan]

That post reaks of effort.

[Bronzetree]

I scoured the 'net a few days ago to see if I could find video of this thing I kept hearing about and I, too, was disgusted when I finally did. There was apparently some kind of bad blood going on between at least a few of the participants, because I saw video of one of the juniors and one of the seniors rolling around on the ground beating the living shit out of each other. There was another spot where a junior was on the ground screaming for someone to help her. Looked like it might have been the girl who broke her ankle. Several people holding girls down to shove shit in their mouths, people getting clocked in the face and head, kicked in the ribs. The whole thing was disturbing.

Sorry, but I doubt the juniors "knew what they were getting themselves into." Hazing is one thing, having shit shovelled into your mouth is another entirely. I refuse to believe they paid money knowing that type of thing would happen. It'd be interesting to see what the senior girls who perpetrated this bullshit went through the year before.

[butter_of_69]

Originally posted by into the void
seeing this kind of social tyranny/brutality really strikes a nerve in me.

We can tell.

Very good post, well thought out. Don't agree with everything in it, but I see your points.

funny, i've been listening to "the doors" while writing this..

Their whole catalog?

Just kidding. It was hard to resist. I appreciate the thought you put into this, especially it being your first post here.

We're all smart-asses anyway, so just ignore me. :)

[DogStarMan]

Yah, that footage kinda' reminded me of that clip they play over and over in the movie "Event Horizon", when the original crew of the ship crosses over into whatever hell or parallel dimension they wind up in and come back gauging their own eyes out and feasting on each others entrails. Kids these days....I'll tell ya' :rolleyes:

I'll second butter's remark on smart asses. I'm one too.

[Danosaur]

i have simply not been able to wrap my head around this hazing, so to speak. there are undeniable variables that brought this hazing about, but all of the pop-psychology in the world will never completely explain the sickening ferocity of how this 'lynching' was strategically premeditated and viciously carried out.

The Holocaust

The Holocaust could not have occurred without the support of many people who would not on their own account take part in the violent destruction of a people, but whom under Nazi leadership acted as murders.

This is an obvious example, but there are so many of them. Every country has extreme examples of what these youth did.

Stalin Russia
Current North Korea
American Slavery
The Crusades
South Africa
Etc.

[IPrayForSound]

Okay, I don't really watch much TV outside of pre-primetime reruns on Fox, so I haven't seen this. Is it online anywhere?

[Bronzetree]

Everywhere. Just do a google search of powder puff football hazing and you should come up with hundreds of links. Vidao can be found on the sites of Chicago TV stations. It's disturbing, man, I warn you.

[IPrayForSound]

Should I just skip the video?

[Bronzetree]

No, you need to see it to truly appreciate how fucked up these kids are.

[into the void]

i'm glad to see that there are at least a few people out there who are bothered by this enough to discuss it.
the fact that more people are not, in my opinion, speaks volumes as to how this 'civilized' culture spawns these type of monsters.

regardless of there being some 'bad blood' between some of girls over 'junior high boyfriends'(please!)there is simply no way to justify, or even explain, this degree of sadism.

i could understand a small group, fueled by one or two rotten apples, taking things too far..but this?..NO..this wasn't something that merely "got out of hand", this is a large group of upper-middle class girls who are shown HAVING FUN beating & smearing human feces & animal guts into the faces of 17 cowering girls.
stop and imagine the mentality and & morality of people who put forth the time & effort to collect dozens upon dozens of buckets of human waste, fish/animal guts, paint thinner & other filth, all with the intended purpose of forcing the gore into the faces of fellow human beings, making them eat it, while violently beating them.
and alcohol is no scapegoat for this..these girls were not intoxicated the days prior to the hazing as they collected the gore, and brought weapons with intent to injure.
i played in heavy metal bar/club bands for several yrs & saw my share of ugly crowds & wild parties, and never saw violence & sadism that comes anywhere close to what happened here.

that's what these girls did, and are clearly shown having a grand ole time doing it.
another interesting thing i've noticed(my wife & i videotaped some of the news clips over the past few weeks..this took place on may 4th)..is that some people in the crowd can clearly be seen wearing those white facial/breathing masks, that have a band that wraps around the back of the head & covers the nose & mouth..like the ones you see people in china wearing to prevent catching SARS germs. so, logically, since many are saying that last years hazing wasn't nearly as violent as this one, and that certainly no human waste was involved, how would people know beforehand to bring the masks? you also can see people in the crowd holding their shirt/sweatshirt sleaves up to their faces covering their nose/mouth.

32 of these little darlings have been suspended & are reported to find out today if the suspensions will stick, thereby leading the school board to expell all involved. unfortunately, it's beginning to look like these girls are going to get off light, and what a horrible message to send to not only the victims & their families, but to the world.

senior girls are suing the school for damaging their upcoming college careers, since an expulsion would be on school transcripts, but the judge has thrown out the first two suits.
ok. good. BUT WHERE THE HELL ARE THE CRIMINAL CHARGES?!
some of these girls need to see some jail time for this, period.
the videotapes show EVERYTHING, they've been caught bang to rights, yet you can imagine some of these girls turning on the waterworks & claiming that they, most assuredly, weren't the ones doing the worst of it..and in a few examples, that may be the case..however, hazing is illegal, and even the few girls who may not have actually beat anyone, THEY ARE STILL SHOWN HAVING FUN BY SMEARING FECES INTO THE FACES OF THE JUNIOR GIRLS..that alone, one would think, is a felony crime. one of the girls was hospitalized with a bacterial infection stemming from this.

there is simply no aspect of what happened, the premeditation, the savage behavior of those involved, the apathetic crowd of bystanders, parental involvement on a criminal level(?) & now the lawsuits brought by the perpetrators(!)against the school..that isn't completely disturbing. shame on northbrook. you all know how kids/girls talk, you cannot tell me that some of the school officials/teachers hadn't caught wind that something bad was in the works. afterall, one of the ways the school was able to suspend was somehow knowing that the girls were planning it while at school.

this is one of those situations that northbrook will never live down, especially since it is reported that if any criminal charges are filed, they will be simple misdemeanors for battery.
if anyone else besides a bunch of spoiled 'cell phone & mtv' brats had done something this violent & appalling, they would've been charged immediately. money does has it's privledges

[into the void]

here's the latest, also, video's & slide shows available
http://www.nbc5.com/news/2208275/detail.html

http://www.suntimes.com/output/steinberg/cst-nws-stein16.html

[butter_of_69]

So, how do you change this? Is it a function of the cultural landscape, or is it a function of bad parenting, or some combination, or something totally different?

I don't doubt that hazing this bad or worse occurs elsewhere, but the secrecy with which it is carried out is hard to combat. I agree that criminal charges need to be filed and pressed as hard as they can. It is ridiculous that these girls feel that THEY are being violated by being expelled. Consequences suck, don't they?

I'm interested in your comments, into the void, since you seem to be so disturbed by this incident. No doubt that it is disturbing, but I can see it has struck a nerve with you.

[Bronzetree]

I've thought about it some more and I really don't think the school should expel these girls. It didn't happen on school grounds or hours and it most likely can't be proven they planned it on school grounds or hours either, even though we know in our hearts they did. I can see why these girls are suing the school, even if I think it's ridiculous.

HOWEVER, if I were the parents of one of the victims, I would damn sure hire the best possible lawyer I could and prosecute to the fullest extent of the law, especially if my kid were one of the injured. Stitches is one girl's HEAD and a broken ankle on another don't warrant assault charges? Insane. If I were one of those victims, I'd just beat the fuck out of my attackers and worry about the consequences later. I'd at least feel better that I sent her ass to the hospital as well.

[IPrayForSound]

What are the odds that any of the girls could do light jail/juvi time for this? I'm guessing that would only apply to the ones who actually physically assaulted the younger girls. Anywho, that would be essentially the same thing as expulsion as they would most likely fail their 4th quarter (assuming they run on quarters) classes and their final exams. Most schools (I think) will not allow you to pass classes if you fail one or both of those.

Also, where do these girls get the balls to publicly criticize the school for messing up their chances to go to a good college by punishing them?!?!

[DogStarMan]

I blame it all on on television...the drug of the nation! Breeding ignorance and feeding radiation.

[Danosaur]

The young attackers assaulted other students at the school, and that makes the attackers a threat to school safety. Also, the victims would have the grounds to sue for emotional damages if the school let the attackers back in the school. If I am violently attacked off school grounds I have the right to be free from my attacker, and that includes when I am attending school, and there is good reason to grant restraining orders against the attackers in this case. Only after the attackers have gone through comprehensive treatment for violence and have sought forgiveness for their actions can they then be released back into the school population, and only under the guidance of a professional. What's sad is that we all know this shit goes on every year all over the country and it takes a video camera and broken bones to ever see anything done about it. I don't know about you, but when I listened to the Principal speak to the press about the incident it became clear the school hadn’t considered the event a big deal. The school didn’t know for a fact what happened at the yearly events, and if the school new for certain that all they were dealing with was a little ketchup and mustard I wouldn’t have a problem with the event. But the school administration didn’t know one way or another, or they were in denial. I was fucked with all of my freshman year during a drafting class, one student who had it worse than me left everyday with welts on his face from rubber band attacks. When I finally sought help from the teacher I was told to fight my own battles. Somebody, some adult in that school knew. The hazing had been going on for years, and as one attendant stated to the affect that this years hazing got out of hand, but it wasn’t far extreme from prior years hazing events.

[Bronzetree]

Good points, dano. I feel ya. Didn't think about it like that. Cuz yeah, if I went to school the next day and saw one of them fucked up little bitches that tortured me, she'd get a shiv right in the spleen. Probably better for their own safety that they're suspended.

[Danosaur]

I hear you too. Man, when I see stuff like this at the high school level it just brings back all those feelings of hatred I had for the bullies from my high school. GRRRR! I remember threatening to take a hammer to a fight that some upper classman was trying to start with me. I told his friend I wanted to bash his head in with the hammer and bite off part of his ear and swallow it in front of his face. I was serious too, I use to fantasize about it at night. Now days I tell people I was just using it as a scare tactic, but that's not the truth.

[classicgrrl]

Originally posted by into the void
another thing i find interesting, if not offensive, is how this hazing has been compared to other teen violence, such as what happened at columbine. in no way am i trying to justify what happened there, but the sad truth is, many times the reason that there are kids who flip out and kill other's and/or themselves, is BECAUSE of girls like the ones who carried out this hazing.
it's often the most presentable, popular kids, usually involved in athletics(extracirricular activity that is in keeping with the most exhaulted characteristics & mindset of the culture)that are the ones who have learned the 'values' very well. they are often the ones who have an unbridled lust for social tyranny, and it's the kids who are singled out for ridicule and abuse, by them, who find their back against the wall with no one to turn to..no one who will 'believe' that there actually are human monsters in the guise of 'good students' , popular kids, whose actions, as apparent by looking at the junior('hazed')girls in these videos, are often scarred for life

one has hit the head on ye 'olde perverbial nail...

[into the void]

someone asked earlier as to why this struck a nerve in me so strongly...

every species, i believe, can sense evil. 'evil' is not a term i use lightly, and i'm not applying it here in the sense of prescribed religious doctrine, no, i'm talking about evil that exists within our species. 'human evil', if you will.
we come into the world with an understanding of evil; we are raised with the knowledge(history, mass media images, common knowledge, etc)of the horrible things that people are capable of doing to one another. it is present in the images of the religious crucades, war atrocities(nazi's, hiroshima/nagasaki, pictures of children in vietnam, screaming, running down a road with huge strips of their flesh seared off from napalm bombings)..not to mention a host of other nightmares.

in order for human beings to justify & carry out horrendous violence/indignities upon others requires a 'demonization'..a perception of those that are being brutalized are somehow 'less-than-human', and thereby, the perpetrators justify their unconscionable actions.
this country does it all the time..look at how effectively propaganda is being used to encourage hatred of the french right now..all because their country wouldn't collectively go along with our presidential administration's policy of pro-war/world domination.

i don't want to stray too far off track here, but you take my meaning. what people see when they watch these hazing video's, even without an understanding of the unspeakable specifics involved, is exactly that kind of evil..and it was plotted and carried out by so many people at once..people who are shown actually having fun doing it.

news centers around the world are reporting an enormous ammount of emails/letters from people who recognize what they know & 'feel' when they see human beings conducting themselves in this mindset..they are frightened, upset and outraged, as any intelligent, senient being SHOULD BE. period.

unfortunately, we've come to take for granted the daily horrors that occur, that are seen on the news. many of our socila ills have become the very stuff of our cultures entertainment.
there is a difference, or a difference in 'degree', upon hearing about someone shooting someone else, or abusing a child, or several killed in a car crash, ya know, as opposed to hearing about something like this hazing, and what it ultimately says about the human condition, and values of a culture.

it is shocking to know that so many people were involved. that this degree of sadism was planned and carried out in the name of fun & entertainment. these are people who will some day be co-workers, supervisors, parents.
18 yr old marnie holz, the first girl to file suit against the school, was to go on to college to major in psychology(!!!) the video clearly shows her smearing handfuls of feces into the faces/hair of the junior girls, and laughing with her counterparts as she does. this sort of behavior isn't 'kids will be kids', ok? this isn't 'something that got out of hand' because the kids had some beer. what took place is appalling. it is evil. it is people who could reduce other human beings to a less-than-human level to justify their actions.

what's more frightening, although not exactly unexpected, is the complete lack of remorse that these girls display after being held accountable. many of these students, those directly involved & some who weren't, simply do not comprehend their actions. to them, it is 'no big deal'.

two sophmore girls at glenbrook were interviewed and claimed that despite knowing what happened at this years hazing, that yes, they would go through with it next year if it were to take place.

!!!???

as i said, there is no aspect of this incident that doesn't have people concerned & scratching their heads.

also, there are very few of us who get through school, those years of early social conditioning, without some dueling scars.
those scars can run deep & leave lifelong impressions about people & the roles they play & influence the paths we walk as adults.
when people see these video's, they recognize & feel those scars from long ago..they know they are looking at that form of inhumane mentality in manifest form, to the nth degree.
this isn't drug dealers & gang members who often are people raised with no way out & no seemingly other choice..no..these are 'good' kids that live in your towns, your neighborhoods. they are people who have had the privledge of, well, 'supposedly', being nurtured & conditoned to be sensitive, intelligent human beings who know the difference between what is right & wrong.
that so many eagerly participated in this... 'chose' this degree of 'wrong', a degree of barbaric inhumanity, apparently without anyone having a conflict of conscience, is absolutely horrifying.

[Danosaur]

I agree with you mostly. I don't know that I agree that these upper class youth were taught good values of right and wrong. Criminals exist among every tier of society, and white-collar crime is the least prosecuted. Many of these youth may have been brought up in the atmosphere of white-collar crime (i.e. do what you have to do to stay rich and powerful). Or maybe these upper class children are little more than an accessory to their parent's lifestyle; a child who is not loved but bought off with material possession. Maybe these youth were the off spring of bad people. One may have all the options in the world, but if you believe they are only given to you to buy you off they are empty opportunities. So I wonder, what affects the criminal mindset more: poverty, or not being loved as a child? Anywho I don't know the specific lives of these people that did this bad thing.

[Bronzetree]

Originally posted by Danosaur
Or maybe these upper class children are little more than an accessory to their parent's lifestyle; a child who is not loved but bought off with material possession. Maybe these youth were the off spring of bad people. One may have all the options in the world, but if you believe they are only given to you to buy you off they are empty opportunities. So I wonder, what affects the criminal mindset more: poverty, or not being loved as a child? Anywho I don't know the specific lives of these people that did this bad thing.

It could be none of these factors. It could just be mob mentality. A couple of kids who are fucked in the head decide they want to take this year's hazing to a new level. Several other kids who aren't nearly as fucked in the head follow suit because everyone else is doing it. It's almost like a feeding frenzy of sharks.

Or it could be any number of other things. Like you said, criminals come from all walks of life. So do kids who think beating the shit out of someone with a baseball bat, recycling tubs and smearing shit in someone's face is "fun." Things certainly have changed in the 14 years since I graduated high school.

[into the void]

danosaur ~ hey, i agree. that's why i wrote "supposedly" taught the difference between right & wrong, and is ultimately one of the points i'm making in regard to what passes for 'normal, right, all-american values' that clearly shape the mindset of youth.

psychologists are quick to point out 'bad parenting' when a kid, or in this case, young adults, do something wrong, and that obviously makes sense. the problem is tricky though; a parent can enstill good values, but an omnipresent culture of greed & the subsequent apathy that is required to be successfully greedy, can easily distort those values.

i don't believe that many parents are equipped to teach their kids how to seriously question the culture they live in..especially parents who let competitive pride & greed govern their own lives. kids pick up on that. if the parents live by 'herd mentality', then chances are good that their kids will also. so they hop in their big & stupid $30, 000 SUV, drive to the mall(soleum) & buy ridiculous jock costumes for him, & psuedo-retro-70's-chick costumes for her. then stop at the quickie-mart for lotto tickets & dry/light/ice beer, & then they're off to chant slogans while they watch "the big game". the intelligence level of the american gene pool is frighteningly low.
my views & observations are made all the more humorous by the fact that i'm a lifelong pot smoker..and according to mainstream propaganda, that supposedly makes me the stupid one.

someone else brought up TV, which i think is a very real influence.
is it life immitating art? or art immitating life? should the people get the entertainment they want(i think so)even if most mainstream sit-coms & movies reflect utter superficiality & room-temperature IQ's?

the line between parody & authenticity is blurry.

i can't believe that given the fact that there were approx. 40 senior girls, 17 junior girls, and anywhere from 100-150 onlookers, that every one of these people were willing to participate strictly due to parents that didn't love them. it just doesn't add up.

there is a very ugly vibe in this culture right now, and unfortunately, this hazing is the most defining, noteworthy news story that represents the quality & values of youth culture today.
which is why i had so much to say about it.

however, pictures can say 1000 words, indeed.

[Danosaur]

I think I agree with you. And on top of that, regardless of these student’s up bringing they are responsible for what they did, and they deserve serious punshiment.

[MsThang]

Originally posted by Danosaur
I... Many of these youth may have been brought up in the atmosphere of white-collar crime (i.e. do what you have to do to stay rich and powerful). ...

I do happen to know some of the "specifics" of these kids lives. One of the girls fighting suspension in Kristin Barrish. Her father Bryan G. Barrish was convicted of a Medicaid fraud last year and was sentenced to 3 yrs probation and a fine.

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/moe/press%20releases/archived%20press%20releases/2002%20press%20releases/june/barrish_bryan.html

So your suspicion that they have not had good parental role models may be correct.