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View Full Version : Why you need to dump MP3 for Vorbis


Bryan
23 Jul 2002, 11:35 AM
I've been waiting for this week for over two years. The open source audio codec Ogg Vorbis 1.0 (http://www.vorbis.com) was finally released this week after years of development. And it's good, very good.

Since this is not focused on explaining audio compression in detail, I'm assuming you already have a basic familiarity with ripping and encoding MP3s onto your computer. My real purpose here is to explain why you need to use Ogg Vorbis instead of other closed source, proprietary formats such as MP3, RealAudio and Windows Media.

Here's the short list of why Ogg Vorbis is significant:

1. Vorbis is open source and completely free for all to use. Contrary to what you may have heard, the MP3 format is not free. The patents are owned by Germany's Fraunhofer Institute and Thomson Multimedia and they charge the makers of MP3 players and encoders for the use of their technology. The also charge a licensing fee for artists and record labels that commercially distribute their music in MP3.

In addition to MP3, the RealAudio and Windows Media codecs are also closed source meaning you have no choice over what happens to the format. If they choose to incorporate some misguided "digital rights management" aka anti-copy protection into the format, you take it whether you want it or not. If they choose to no longer support the format, tough luck for you. If they decide to start charging consumers for the technology, you pay.

2. Vorbis sounds better than MP3. At the same bitrate, Vorbis sounds much better than MP3 at the same bitrate/filesize. Alternatively, you can get the same quality at a much lower bitrate and hence, filesize. Vorbis is also uses Variable Bitrate Encoding, VBR, as standard. This allows for increased quality at a reduced filesize. MP3 can do variable bitrate but it's not standardized with different implementations floating around out there. Some hardware audio players will play VBR MP3 and some will not. With Vorbis, all devices that can play Vorbis files will implement VBR as standard.

The quality of Vorbis is comparable to Windows Media 8 and RealAudio 8 at the same bitrate. Hear for yourself at the Vorbis demo page. (http://www.xiph.org/ogg/vorbis/listen.html)

3. Vorbis is cross-platform and cross-player. Do you use Windows, Mac and Linux to listen to your music files? Not a problem. Because Vorbis is open source, an implementation exists for many different computer platforms and players. Try listening to your Windows Media files on Linux... doubt it, because Micro$oft does not and never will make Windows Media available for Linux. RealAudio is available for multiple operating systems but you still have to use the increasingly invasive, intrusive and bloated RealPlayer. Proprietary, closed source audio codec = strapped to a proprietary, closed source and often intrusive audio player.

MP3 is better in this respect because you can use many different media players... Winamp, iTunes, XMMS, mpg123, Audion, etc, and yes, even Windows Media Player or RealPlayer if you like. But the quality of MP3 is still inferior when compared with RealAudio and Windows Media.

So there has been the compromise in years past. You get good audio quality and low filesizes but you're chained to proprietary media players -or- you sacrifice quality for cross-platform and cross-player compatibility.

But now it's all about choice. The format in which you encode your audio files no longer has to dictate what operating system and media player you use.


There are many dangers in allowing one or two companies to control multimedia standards. Just look at what happens when you allow one company to control the market for computer operating systems... And for this reason, there needs to be a free and open audio codec, free from the profiteering of corporate hustlers pushing their own agenda rather than developing an open multimedia standard.

I've compiled a list of links that offer more information on Vorbis and the greater Ogg project, as well as software for encoding and playing Vorbis files.

Vorbis FAQ Series:
What is Ogg Vorbis? (http://www.vorbis.com/intro.html)
Encoding files with Vorbis (http://www.vorbis.com/encoding.html)
Playing files with Vorbis (http://www.vorbis.com/playing.html)

Vorbis.com (http://www.vorbis.com)
The main Vorbis site with info, downloads, links and more. Download the Vorbis code here.

Exact Audio Copy (http://exactaudiocopy.de/)
Excellent CD ripper program that is free and also supports Vorbis encoding.

CDex (http://www.cdex.n3.net/)
An open source CD ripper that's a little easier to use than EAC. Also supports Vorbis encoding.

Xiph Foundation (http://www.xiph.org)
The parent organization to the Vorbis project. They also work on development of the Ogg Tarkin video codec, the recently accounced Theora video codec, the cdparanoia ripping program and more.

Darth Sandmich!
23 Jul 2002, 08:24 PM
What's the word on the street about hardware vendorsa supporting this codec? They always seem hot and bothered to support the latest encrypted music crapola, I wonder if they'll adopt this as quickly.

DogStarMan
24 Jul 2002, 06:28 AM
Good lookin' out Bryan. Sounds cool and all, but I will wait for the players to come out that support this format before I start converting my entire MP3 library.

Bryan
25 Jul 2002, 11:18 AM
Darth - Hardware support should be forthcoming. Since the format is absolutely patent free, it won't cost the hardware makers a dime to include it. I definitely agree that hardware support in portable players is crucial for wide acceptance. If I could just get a car stereo that supported the Vorbis format on CDR, I'd be in heaven.

DSM - If you're talking about software players, there are already tons out there. Check out the FAQ above. If you're talking about hardware players, I agree.

Another point, make sure not to transcode files... meaning turn an MP3 into a Vorbis. It wreaks havoc with the lossy compression and results in poor quality. Always encode from the original source if possible and leave the MP3s as MP3s.

DogStarMan
25 Jul 2002, 11:27 AM
Originally posted by Bryan
If you're talking about software players, there are already tons out there. Check out the FAQ above. If you're talking about hardware players, I agree.

Another point, make sure not to transcode files... meaning turn an MP3 into a Vorbis. It wreaks havoc with the lossy compression and results in poor quality. Always encode from the original source if possible and leave the MP3s as MP3s.
Nope, I was talking about hardware players. I have a great MP3 CD player that I love to death. When support for Vorbis comes to hardware, I may consider using it.

As far as conversion problems, that news just downright sucks. I've spent about a year ripping all of my CDs to MP3 format and I'm not too eager to start that over again.:p

RichmondVA
25 Jul 2002, 11:52 AM
Hey DSM,

I agree that Vorbis isn't that useful yet, but try to use it at least a little bit anyway. It's free and it's good but mostly we need to support the concept it stands for.

The larger issue is that by using Vorbis we are encouraging other programmers to get together and develop stuff. It's promoting the idea that writing good code and sharing it is the quickest and best way to develop a market for your product, not smothering competitors through barriers to entry.

Take stand against the MAN! :D

DogStarMan
25 Jul 2002, 12:19 PM
I'm down with that mah brutha! I've already posted Bryan's info on other message boards I frequent (techier ones) and got good feedback. The domino effect has started.

Bryan
25 Jul 2002, 08:42 PM
DSM - The reencoding problem is not Vorbis specific. Anytime you encode from one lossy format to another, there's going to be quality problems. But there's no need to reencode your MP3s. Just keep em as is. I'm sure any hardware player that adds support for Vorbis will still support MP3.

RichmondVA - Definitely agree. More than anything it's about supporting a free and open multimedia standard. People are going to have to demand it to provide hardware makers with the incentive to incorporate it into their products. It's the same thing with any media format. If consumers want MP3, content producers and software and hardware makers will continue to deliver and support that format despite it's technical inferiority. So consumers need to stand up and say they want Vorbis.

And here's the really cool thing... once the Icecast2 streaming server is finished up, you'll get streaming Vorbis! The low bitrate quality of RealAudio and Window$ Media without having to use proprietary audio players or being forced to use a particular operating system. I hope to have a Vorbis test stream for 97X in the next few months.

DogStarMan
26 Jul 2002, 06:35 AM
That sold me Bryan. I'm downloading it today. Thanks again for the info oh digital savant and saviour. ;)

Darth Sandmich!
26 Jul 2002, 07:52 AM
Originally posted by Bryan
DSM - But there's no need to reencode your MP3s. Just keep em as is.I thought of this too, I thought of all the trouble of re-encoding my stuff, but then I thought, why bother, Winamp can play both. Now my Nomad on the other hand... Originally posted by Bryan
I hope to have a Vorbis test stream for 97X in the next few months. SWEET!

DogStarMan
23 Apr 2003, 08:31 AM
I had to resurrect this thread after finding a cool utility that works equally well with MP3 and Vorbis..
{Audio CD ripper and encoder} BonkEnc is an encoder and converter for various audio formats that can produce MP3, Ogg Vorbis, BONK, AAC, and VQF files. More formats are available using plug-ins. To invoke the command line interface, use the '--console' parameter. The program is available in ten languages and can be translated to others using the program's "smooth Translator" utility. CDDB/freedb queries and CDText are supported. Track information is automatically written to ID3V2 or Vorbis comment tags. The latest version has been upgraded to use CDRip v117, LAME version3.93.1, FAAC version 1.14, and smooth v0.98.61.0. To make it easy to operate, it has drag and drop support.

http://www.bonkenc.org/

Kwyjibo
01 May 2003, 05:00 PM
I personally believe that lossy audio compression is the devil. However, I agree with what Vorbis stands for.

If you agree with the lossy audio=musical pergatory (for sharing, not for personal use mind you) try .shn... I was skeptical, but it's good stuff. Absoultely lossless compression, it makes big files, which sucks, but it's a lot smaller than .wav.