New stuff from those 'respectable' Swift Boaters

[Sofa King]

http://photos1.blogger.com/img/187/1525/400/aarp12.jpg

Lookie what the people behind the Swift Boaters for Hate and their friends USA Next are up to now. It's a classy new ad that attacks the AARP in an effort to dismantle socal security.

"The lobbying group, USA Next, which has poured millions of dollars into Republican policy battles, now says it plans to spend as much as $10 million on commercials and other tactics assailing AARP, the powerhouse lobby opposing the private investment accounts at the center of Mr. Bush's plan."

Apparently, from the ad, the AARP hates the troops and loves the gay guys.


Good stuff.

Classy.

If the ad doesn't show, then click on the attachment here:

[jps]

maybe this thread will get more traction that this one: http://www.woxy.com/boards/showthread.php?t=24128
its disguting what the swifty guys will stoop to. though i guess we knew that already.

[Sofa King]

Sorry JPS, I never saw that thread.

If they are against the AARP that's fine...but you can retaliate with some shred of dignity and class. The ad is irrelevant and distatesful, and when you click it, it only goes to the USA Next website and offers no explanation of the ad's accusation.

But, however, it is exactly what I would expect from those guys.

[Orville Wrong]

The Swift Boat Veterans for Truth are not involved here, unless I'm missing something. USA Next is EXACTLY the same as MoveOn.org -- again, unless I'm missing something.

[jps]

its being funded in part by the same people and the ad agency or ad executives, producers, writers, etc. that did the swift boat ads are a part of this campaign.

[Orville Wrong]

Yeah, but the SBVT themselves were a one-shot (unless Kerry runs again), and aren't behind this ad -- which is, pardon the pun, totally gay.

[Sofa King]

The Swift Boat Veterans for Truth are not involved here, unless I'm missing something.

According to the USA Next website, they have joined with Chris LaCivita (also the political director of the National Republican Senatorial Committee) and Rick Reed (to name a few) of the Swift Boat camapaign to do the new ads and commercials.

[Orville Wrong]

Chris LaCivita and Rick Reed

Are not veterans of riverine warfare in Indochina, though.

[Sofa King]

Chris Lacivita is a senior advisor of the Swift Boat Vets for Bush.

[Orville Wrong]

But not a Swift Boat Vet.

[skytrack]

But not a Swift Boat Vet.

Exactly, the swift boat vets are not involved. This is just more liberal double-talk mumbo jumbo.

Lemme guess... Bush is evil. Our troops are dying because of him. Homosexuality should be taught in elementary schools. Iraqi's don't deserve and don't understand freedom. Any type of censorship is bad. The Bible and those "oppressing Christians" are low-IQ morons. Did I get them all?

[Digit1001]

Exactly, the swift boat vets are not involved. This is just more liberal double-talk mumbo jumbo.

Lemme guess... Bush is evil. Our troops are dying because of him. Homosexuality should be taught in elementary schools. Iraqi's don't deserve and don't understand freedom. Any type of censorship is bad. The Bible and those "oppressing Christians" are low-IQ morons. Did I get them all?

Most of them, but I don't see any "double-talk" in any of that. :D

[tobedawg]

Lemme guess... Bush is evil. Our troops are dying because of him. Homosexuality should be taught in elementary schools. Iraqi's don't deserve and don't understand freedom. Any type of censorship is bad. The Bible and those "oppressing Christians" are low-IQ morons. Did I get them all?

Wow! It's NICE to know that you get your paranoid World View from "The 700 Club" and let the American Taliban dictate to you which issues are important to you!

Exactly, the swift boat vets are not involved. This is just more liberal double-talk mumbo jumbo.

HAHA!! Funniest thing I've read all day.. You actually trust an administration that puts Male Prostititutes in the White House and passes them off as Press Corps Reporters?

The point is: Any administration that will do such a thing (Not to mention the Armstrong Williams/paid columnists scandal) is capable of anything..

[Orville Wrong]

I don't get why the GOP would attack the AARP this viciously. Because they oppose a Social Security Reform plan that doesn't even exist yet?

Old people skew conservative, so taking them for granted is safe. But why antagonize them? I'm guessing Rove is pissed at these loose cannons.

[skytrack]

Wow! It's NICE to know that you...let the American Taliban dictate to you which issues are important to you!

Who? The ACLU? Ohhh, i'm sorry. You're right. The important issues involve removing miniscule crucifixes from local county seals and making sure the boys scouts don't meet at public parks.

Surely you weren't talking about the Bush administration or christian organizations. Through the great work of our military and diplomacy, the united states has freed more people in it's 300 year history than all other nations in history -combined-. Lets face it, you're a typical far-left radical who believes that America is oppressing others and that we were the ones who caused the 9/11 devastation. You attack religious organizations that do nothing but help others globally, and you have the audacity to say that there is no real threat to our way of life by terrorists. Unfortunately this is why the democratic party has recently suffered - there is a fundamental disconnect in values and a lack of respect for our freedom.

[tobedawg]

Surely you weren't talking about the Bush administration or christian organizations. Through the great work of our military and diplomacy, the united states has freed more people in it's 300 year history than all other nations in history -combined-. Lets face it, you're a typical far-left radical who believes that America is oppressing others and that we were the ones who caused the 9/11 devastation. You attack religious organizations that do nothing but help others globally, and you have the audacity to say that there is no real threat to our way of life by terrorists. Unfortunately this is why the democratic party has recently suffered - there is a fundamental disconnect in values and a lack of respect for our freedom.

WOW! Sean Hannity's talking points schooled you well!!
"The United States has FREED more people in it's 300 year history".. The U.S. has also enslaved Africans, also contributed to dictatorships that have oppressed people around the globe, overthrown democratically elected government officials in favor of U.S. friendly dictators around the World (Iran comes to mind) ..

When the Religious fundamentalists came to this country, they held crusades and burned witches..

Religious organizations that "do nothing but help others globally".. Yep.. like not supporting comprehensive AIDS education in Africa or bombing and killing children in Iraq... Great compassionate people! I misjudged Fawlwell, Robertson, and their ilk.., They are holy people of compassion that just happen to think that women are too stupid to make decisions regarding their pregnancy, that Africans should just be left to be ignorent and die from AIDS, and that believe that Queers should to.. AND that bombing and killing innocent children is the way to achieve peace..

Mr. Bush is a great man too!! He should be able to bomb and kill whoever he wants and give whatever reasons he wants with no accountability!! He also should be able to liberate the American public from deciding for themselves by paying off whatever journalists, reporters, and Swift Boat Assholes he wants to spread his truth!! Glory Glory Hallelujah! His Truth is Marching On!

[Digit1001]

Tobe,

If you're ever in Chicago, let me buy you a beer.

[Orville Wrong]

You actually trust an administration that puts Male Prostititutes in the White House and passes them off as Press Corps Reporters?
Comment rescinded for excess irony.

[Digit1001]

I love America. It's a great country, and perhaps we've done a lot to help other nations. We helped remove Hitler from France, we supplied the Allies before joining them with troops. We've introduced medicines that have helped cure diseases all across the globe.

We've also built large drug companies, chemical companies, manufacturing plants etc. that have grossed insane profits in the process. We're the only nation to resort to nuclear weapons (so far), we built our nation on the backs of slaves and ran out the native inhabitants.

I don't think our history is all good or all bad. I like to think of it as a work in progress, and hoping that progress doesn't waste the planet for the sake of good quarterly returns, or sacrificing young, middle to lower-class youths so that old, upper class adults can add a couple of zeros to their stock portfolio may brand me a liberal in some of your eyes. I'm ok with that.

The fight to keep things like the teaching of Genesis in the science class may sound like it's anti-Christian, but I think it's just defending the secular system our fore-fathers set up. I don't think it's paranoid in the least to believe that if Fallwell and his bretheren had their way that we'd lose a lot of the culture that we may currently take for granted. And I'm not just referring to Hustler.

[markalot]

Did someone mention male prostitutes?

[skytrack]

WOW! Sean Hannity's talking points schooled you well!!
"The United States has FREED more people in it's 300 year history".. The U.S. has also enslaved Africans, also contributed to dictatorships that have oppressed people around the globe, overthrown democratically elected government officials in favor of U.S. friendly dictators around the World (Iran comes to mind) ..

When the Religious fundamentalists came to this country, they held crusades and burned witches..

Religious organizations that "do nothing but help others globally".. Yep.. like not supporting comprehensive AIDS education in Africa or bombing and killing children in Iraq... Great compassionate people! I misjudged Fawlwell, Robertson, and their ilk.., They are holy people of compassion that just happen to think that women are too stupid to make decisions regarding their pregnancy, that Africans should just be left to be ignorent and die from AIDS, and that believe that Queers should to.. AND that bombing and killing innocent children is the way to achieve peace..

Mr. Bush is a great man too!! He should be able to bomb and kill whoever he wants and give whatever reasons he wants with no accountability!! He also should be able to liberate the American public from deciding for themselves by paying off whatever journalists, reporters, and Swift Boat Assholes he wants to spread his truth!! Glory Glory Hallelujah! His Truth is Marching On!

You are so misguided i don't even know where to begin. As much as i'd love to continue arguing with you about this, i can already see that there would be no way you and i would ever come to an agreement. Not only do you not understand why certain individuals or groups have taken certain actions, but you twist their reasoning for doing so in an effort to let yourself believe what you want. You think Christians want to stop abortion because "women are too stupid to decide for themselves?" Are you serious? The real and obvious reason is that what is inside of a woman is alive. Call it a fetus, baby, whatever, but our priority as a society, like you've mentioned, is to protect those who cannot protect themselves.

Answer this: Why is it that if i get in my car and hit a pregnant woman i can, and will, be tried for both deaths? Ironically, she could have been walking to her local planned parenthood to schedule an abortion. The bottomline is that we need to decide if an unborn child is alive or not. If I can be tried for killing an unborn child, then so should every woman who has an abortion. The baby is NOT her body, this is something the pro-abortion folks like to say, but it's just plain false.

Oh and also, i dont listen to Hannity. He's much too arrogant for me. Nice try though.

flame on

[tobedawg]

You are so misguided i don't even know where to begin. As much as i'd love to continue arguing with you about this, i can already see that there would be no way you and i would ever come to an agreement. Not only do you not understand why certain individuals or groups have taken certain actions, but you twist their reasoning for doing so in an effort to let yourself believe what you want. You think Christians want to stop abortion because "women are too stupid to decide for themselves?" Are you serious? The real and obvious reason is that what is inside of a woman is alive. Call it a fetus, baby, whatever, but our priority as a society, like you've mentioned, is to protect those who cannot protect themselves.

No! I don't understand WHY a group of religious fanatics want to push their agenda of invading countries and killing innocent people and calling it "Liberation" meanwhile turning a blind eye to the President's family and the Vice President's former company AND the financial backers of the President, who are making $$$ from the killing and maiming of U.S. Soldiers.. Great Patriotism! Makes Me Wanna sing that Lee Greenwood song! .. I also don't understand why this same group of zealots is overly concerned with somebody's right to marry the person that they love, meanwhile, they support a President that believes that a woman on welfare should get more benefits as an incentive to get married.. Oh! That's right Marriage is for Procreation!

"Protecting those that Cannot Protect themselves!".. So..Why is it that these same religious zealots who are SCREAMING about the right to life and blowing up Planned Parenthoods the same ones that support "HANGING THE BASTARD" when it comes to death-row cases! Under Governor Bush in the state of Texas, a mentally retarded man was executed.. Was he able to defend himself? Where were all of these religious zealots when this happened?

Answer this: Why is it that if i get in my car and hit a pregnant woman i can, and will, be tried for both deaths? Ironically, she could have been walking to her local planned parenthood to schedule an abortion. The bottomline is that we need to decide if an unborn child is alive or not. If I can be tried for killing an unborn child, then so should every woman who has an abortion. The baby is NOT her body, this is something the pro-abortion folks like to say, but it's just plain false.

So are you saying that you WANT to hit a pregnant woman? Is that a fantasy of yours? Oh.. Now I understand!

[DaHood]

I love America. It's a great country, and perhaps we've done a lot to help other nations. We helped remove Hitler from France, we supplied the Allies before joining them with troops. We've introduced medicines that have helped cure diseases all across the globe.

We've also built large drug companies, chemical companies, manufacturing plants etc. that have grossed insane profits in the process. We're the only nation to resort to nuclear weapons (so far), we built our nation on the backs of slaves and ran out the native inhabitants.

I don't think our history is all good or all bad. I like to think of it as a work in progress, and hoping that progress doesn't waste the planet for the sake of good quarterly returns, or sacrificing young, middle to lower-class youths so that old, upper class adults can add a couple of zeros to their stock portfolio may brand me a liberal in some of your eyes. I'm ok with that.

The fight to keep things like the teaching of Genesis in the science class may sound like it's anti-Christian, but I think it's just defending the secular system our fore-fathers set up. I don't think it's paranoid in the least to believe that if Fallwell and his bretheren had their way that we'd lose a lot of the culture that we may currently take for granted. And I'm not just referring to Hustler.

Very reasonable.

[Sofa King]

But not a Swift Boat Vet.

Never said he was. I said "Lookie what the people behind the Swift Boaters for Hate and their friends USA Next are up to now."

[skytrack]

Never said he was. I said "Lookie what the people behind the Swift Boaters for Hate and their friends USA Next are up to now."

oh... So that's what the thread was named. I thought I couldn't read for a minute. :rolleyes:

[Handy Smurf]

No! I don't understand WHY a group of religious fanatics want to push their agenda of invading countries and killing innocent people and calling it "Liberation" meanwhile turning a blind eye to the President's family and the Vice President's former company AND the financial backers of the President, who are making $$$ from the killing and maiming of U.S. Soldiers.. Great Patriotism! Makes Me Wanna sing that Lee Greenwood song! .. I also don't understand why this same group of zealots is overly concerned with somebody's right to marry the person that they love, meanwhile, they support a President that believes that a woman on welfare should get more benefits as an incentive to get married.. Oh! That's right Marriage is for Procreation!

"Protecting those that Cannot Protect themselves!".. So..Why is it that these same religious zealots who are SCREAMING about the right to life and blowing up Planned Parenthoods the same ones that support "HANGING THE BASTARD" when it comes to death-row cases! Under Governor Bush in the state of Texas, a mentally retarded man was executed.. Was he able to defend himself? Where were all of these religious zealots when this happened?



So are you saying that you WANT to hit a pregnant woman? Is that a fantasy of yours? Oh.. Now I understand!
Tobe, I certainly dont agree with Skytrak, but in an effort to be objective, youre way off base. I dont know how you link religion to bombing children.
Second, there is a very small population of moronic people that inflict physical harm on people working in abortion clinics/waste their lives standing outside abortion clinics screaming and waving signs/act like asses handing out fliers with an abortion clinic workers name and address and a picture of an aborted baby to people in the neighborhood. I would wager that this faction of "christians" is much smaller than say, the environmental guerillas who think its good policy to go around vandalizing private citizens property. Either way its not fair to characterize one group by its insane fringe members. I'm sure environmentalist members of this board wouldnt appreciate you ranting and raving above how they are arsonists and criminals who go around destroying peoples property. To use such broad generalizations is idiotic on your part.
Third, we've already had a discussion in a thread establishing what the church's(Catholic church at least) stance is on the death penalty issue. Oh yeah, right, theyre against it.
I may be a recovering catholic, but i still find your comments to be insulting while simultaneously demonstrating a severe lack of knowledge in the area you choose to start railing about

[Orville Wrong]

Never said he was. I said "Lookie what the people behind the Swift Boaters for Hate and their friends USA Next are up to now."
See thread title.

[RealNeal]

Ugh, like it matters in the slightest that the actual veterans aren't involved with this! The slimeballs are the PR people who made a group of disgruntled veterans (and their mostly made-up claims) look like an important movement. Those same PR people, known for their Swift Boat related activities, are involved in this. I see no problem in referring to them in shorthand as The Swift Boat people.

"Same Slime Machine that was behind the Swift Boaters at it again" is a little too long of a thread title. We all know what it means, so shut the f--k up about it not being the actual veterans already! You make DaSpellChecka's corrections look important in comparison!

Or Orville et al, do you actually want to debate whether the AARP's "Real Agenda" is anti-troop and pro-gay-marriage?

[Orville Wrong]

Ugh, like it matters in the slightest that the actual veterans aren't involved with this! The slimeballs are the PR people who made a group of disgruntled veterans (and their mostly made-up claims) look like an important movement. Those same PR people, known for their Swift Boat related activities, are involved in this. I see no problem in referring to them in shorthand as The Swift Boat people.

"Same Slime Machine that was behind the Swift Boaters at it again" is a little too long of a thread title. We all know what it means, so shut the f--k up about it not being the actual veterans already! You make DaSpellChecka's corrections look important in comparison!

Or Orville et al, do you actually want to debate whether the AARP's "Real Agenda" is anti-troop and pro-gay-marriage?
"Neal" in front of my open zipper, slapnuts.

I made it quite clear earlier in the thread that I thought the ad is ludicrous. The SBVT had the goods on Kerry and couldn't countenance him as CIC, and the "slime machine" knew how to make that happen. Mission accomplished. The SBVT won't be back unless Kerry is.

[RealNeal]

Oh, hey, did we mention that USANext has already been fined a half million dollars for trying to deceive seniors about Social Security?

From the Social Security website (link) (http://www.ssa.gov/oig/executive_operations/eyeonoig/eyeoig08282003.htm)

" Penalty Upheld Against United Seniors Association, Inc. [aka USANext] for Misleading Advertising
Judge Denies Appeal of $554,196 Civil Monetary Penalty

On August 8, a Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) Appeals Board Administrative Law Judge (ALJ) issued a ruling upholding the imposition of a $554,196 civil monetary penalty against the United Seniors Association, Inc. (USA Inc.). The ALJ found that USA Inc. violated Section 1140 of the Social Security Act, which protects Social Security program words and symbols from being used in a misleading manner. Over the course of several years, USA Inc. mailed solicitations to senior citizens in envelopes that appeared to be from, approved, endorsed or authorized by SSA. USA Inc. targeted these solicitations to senior citizens with envelopes that included such terminology as “SOCIAL SECURITY ALERT” in prominent, red type. USA Inc. consistently refused to cooperate with OIG’s compliance efforts over the course of 5 years. Therefore, OCIG proposed the penalty, and the parties had a full evidentiary hearing in April 2003. The ALJ’s August 8th ruling found that: USA, Inc. had “deliberately contravened the law,” the $554,196 penalty was reasonable, and USA’s envelopes created a “serious threat to the ability of the Social Security Administration to communicate freely with the public.” USA Inc. has the right to appeal the ALJ’s decision to the full HHS Departmental Appeals Board."

[Phreon]

The hilarity of this thread stems from you folx who honestly believe the Bush administration is so much worse than the last. Wake the fuck up, they're all politicians, Democrat or Republican.

Why do you suppose the AARP opposes a private social security plan? It wouldn't be because it'd deprive their constituents of their god given right to have their retirement paid for by a younger generation?

I'll believe you hard core liberal/Democrat types are any different from any other radical political wing when your ilk quits trying to tell me there's no problem with social security in the forseeable future. No problem if you're a boomer and on the receiving end. It's a royal shaft when you're a Gen-Xer who'll have to pay for TWO boomers each by the time they retire. Will my future benefits include a giant tub of vaseline to ease the financial ass rape the current politicians are proposing?

Pass the problem on to the next generation...what's wrong with that? Fuck politicians!

Phreon

[tobedawg]

Tobe, I certainly dont agree with Skytrak, but in an effort to be objective, youre way off base. I dont know how you link religion to bombing children.

2 Words: Al Queda.. A Severly extreme faction of the Muslim Religion.. It has nothing to do with Religion but using religion to justify hatred and extremism..

Second, there is a very small population of moronic people that inflict physical harm on people working in abortion clinics/waste their lives standing outside abortion clinics screaming and waving signs/act like asses handing out fliers with an abortion clinic workers name and address and a picture of an aborted baby to people in the neighborhood. I would wager that this faction of "christians" is much smaller than say, the environmental guerillas who think its good policy to go around vandalizing private citizens property. Either way its not fair to characterize one group by its insane fringe members. I'm sure environmentalist members of this board wouldnt appreciate you ranting and raving above how they are arsonists and criminals who go around destroying peoples property. To use such broad generalizations is idiotic on your part.

GENERALIZATIONS LIKE THIS: Posted by: Skylark -- Lemme guess... Bush is evil. Our troops are dying because of him. Homosexuality should be taught in elementary schools. Iraqi's don't deserve and don't understand freedom. Any type of censorship is bad. The Bible and those "oppressing Christians" are low-IQ morons. Did I get them all?

Why? It isn't the TRUE Christians or believers of Christ that are backing the Bush Agenda, front line and center.. It's the EXTREMISTS! It's the Fawlwells, The Robertsons, and the Dobsons that were the first to step up and claim victory after Election and even made a threat to Republicans that "If they don't pass their agenda, they WILL pay the price".. I Didn't Generalize Christians or Religious people and mold them in with the American Taliban..

I may be a recovering catholic, but i still find your comments to be insulting while simultaneously demonstrating a severe lack of knowledge in the area you choose to start railing about

Also, I NEVER referred to these zealots as Christians! They are not christians and I could really care less if you are offended by my not referring to them as such..
Third, we've already had a discussion in a thread establishing what the church's(Catholic church at least) stance is on the death penalty issue. Oh yeah, right, theyre against it.

I was pointing out that many Religious Zealots and Extremists who are against a Woman's Right to choose are the same ones taht are using Bible quotes to justify the Death penalty, I didn't specify ANY church's position on any specific issue.. I talked about RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS.. The Catholic Church is also against Molesting Children but they still allow that to happen and didn't really start cleaning things up until after they were investegated.. BUT that is a completely different issue.. All Religions have corruption and extremists within them, however, when that corruption begins to affect the "laws of the land", is it so wrong to object to what is being done?

The issue at hand is the Swift Boat Veterans/ a front group for Karl Rove and the Bush Administration running Propaganda on the TV against the AARP because they object to Bush's Social Security Plan.. I've said it before, here it goes again: In a day and age where male prostitutes can enter the White House and be on the Press Corps, where columnists are paid to push Administration policies like "No Child Left Behind", and where the mainstream news media is afraid to print or discuss stories, this comes as absolutely NO surprise.. How they get from disagreeing with Bush's Social Security plan to the promotion of Same - Sex Marriage is beyond me.. BUT I guess this "Swift Boat" groups like the GENERALIZE, GENERALIZE, GENERALIZE huh?